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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 14, 2011 18:53:08 GMT -5
Below is a post from the AMW website from March 2005-This is before AMW put the site down and deleted it...{after they investigated}-
"I am “John’s” sister, Mary, identified in several posts on this AMW site in the last few weeks. I received a telephone call from Kdogg after AMW posted my name and employer. He indicated that my family and my brother John, in particular, were the subject of forums on the AMW website, that Helen’s allegations had gone “national” and that I should check it out. He thought that posting personal information was out of line especially because of the content of the postings. He later contacted me about other sites which revealed personal information about my brother and family. Before Kdogg called me, I had absolutely NO KNOWLEDGE, nor did my family, of what Helen was doing or saying on the internet. (thank you Kdogg). I have read some of the information posted and I am horrified by the lies and delusions of Helen and others who have believed her. //////
First of all AMW did not post your name and employer...Misty did that all on her own...she was angry with me..because I kicked her to the curb...because of her insanity....and most of it was because I wouldn't join her in her quest to name John as Jon Bennett Ramsey killer...as for the going national-lol....the families can not even get national exposure they have tried....they even knew people from the local area who have gone on to reporter jobs with big networks...they never even answer their request.Next-He Kdogg} thought that posting personal information was out of line especially because of the content of the postings....Oh please at that time Kdogg morals were lower than a sewer rat...I will post that all under a different title ...as the things he and his cronies did to me...were inexcusable-and although I have forgiven him-It is still all part of the Occk underbelly-
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 14, 2011 18:57:21 GMT -5
And even when posters who knew there were maps-you still denied it-(I don't know if you are following the anti-Helen thread on AMW. For what it's worth there really isn't much of facts and more of reactions. That is expected. Of course we also have responses from dime store analyst thrown in for good measure that seem to have the answer to everything from pure surface speculation. I decided to post there after I read about the total denial of the existence of the map drawings. I just couldn't help myself. I know that part of your story is fact. The following (below) were my post from a few weeks ago including post number for your records.) I'm sure you remember this post Mary
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 14, 2011 19:00:16 GMT -5
You do realize you are both stepping on a Train -to nowhere-.Helen has been in the public,for forty-five years that I know of,and she has had a lot sharper people then the two of you attacked her,and she will survive,so why not put all that evil energy into something worth while,I really would not distrust Kevin and Mystic so much,if they hadn't started out with guns drawn and verbal jibes equivalent to a bayonet!As much as I would like to believe Kevin would like to see the OCCK cases resolved,I do believe Kevin wants to bask in glory and the fact is,i don't like his style.As for Mystic,it is unfortunate that she is not well because she clearly has the talent and ability to do mega- research-.However to give out information,that was clearly privileged after you had told her not to,she almost acts like this is a game and the people are not real to her,what ashamed she has to be so Evil,I have been to her site,you can tell she puts a lot of time and effort into it and it reads very well,until you get to her theories,then she reads like a NUT!I will agree about her post on the AMW site,they portray her badly as she doesn't take accountability for herself,someone else has always said it or done it,but not Mystic,hopefully she will get back on track and will realize her talent should be used in a more appropriate manner Xxxx
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 14, 2011 19:17:49 GMT -5
So Mary you didn't know what was going on? You didn't know John drew the Maps? Well that is BS...Because when you were at your Interview at The Birmingham Police Dept. on March 12,1992-You sure were made aware that I had accused your brother of being a Serial Killer-Don Studt showed you a copy of a map-and here is what he said to you-From FOIA document-BLK-01628-*~ When shown a copy of the map that John drew and the detail,she (Mary) was rather surprised,but said John draws frequently and would know the area from living down here and driving around,He has a very good memory~ ** and you Mary who are said to be a Genius-forgot that you were Interviewed by Don and shown a map?? I don't think so-In fact I know better-I have the Documents to prove it-and there are many more~ So why did you choose to go on AMW and post that John didn't draw any maps-you mean that from 1992 untill your Internet Debut in 2004-5 -you had forgotten-seems to me-your recollection would have been jolted -when the posters -mention Maps and Serial Killer-
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 14, 2011 19:36:36 GMT -5
FOIA DOC- 01628-Marys interview-will be on the next video-So will move on to other things -said by the family-that just don't pass the smell test-and all of them are Documented-It is time to get this show on the road!
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 14, 2011 20:37:46 GMT -5
Mary If There Is anything on this thread that is not true-Then Email me or call me -so that I can remove it- Bingotank@aol.com
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 14, 2011 21:02:09 GMT -5
This was one of your post Mary-Unsolved Cases - THE OCCK, HELEN DAGNER AND JOHN notify me whenever anyone posts in this discussionSubscribe From: sisterofjohn May-11 11:00 pm To: ALL 297 of 298 3183.297 in reply to 3183.295
Helen: I have nothing to say to you other than what has been said - Stop telling lies about john and my family. I did not email you nor do I care to speak with a liar.
Why does Helen keep posting old emails from people, particularly Kevin? We all know Kevin went to the police and is working with them here in Michigan and is actually helping the investigation rather than what she does.
Helen has has chosen to harrass this person at his workplace by calling his employer and accusing him of things that are untrue. Why? Because he disagreed with her "cult" and went out to find the truth? Because Helen has dissenters? Because reality is forcing its way into her world?
People wonder why Kevin has a "vast knowledge" about the OCCK. ITS BECAUSE HE ACTUALLY TALKS WITH THE POLICE WHO ARE INVESTIGATING THE CRIMES! I would suggest to all Helen's "followers" that they check things out themselves ..listen to the police....to the other side of the story.
It is hilarious that those accusing Kevin of not having a clue, have themselves NOTHING but Helen's lies. Kevin has at least talked with law enforcement officials and ruled out the vain imaginings of the self made, self deputized, self glorified, self proclaimed HD
TO the reader who checks helens board before the feet hit the floor: What exaclty are you going to do when Helen gives you the name and address of an innocent person accused of horrific crimes? Take vengeance into your own hands? Do what the OCCK did - kill innocent people?
TO DON'S FRIEND who wrote : "Say Don,I want to report a 55 year old women,who is skimming the Gov.,gets a disability ck,as she is unable to work she says,but she types on her site,about 12 hours a day,I want to send them the url,so they can ck this out.I'm sure there are a lot of places were she could work an 8hr day." ---------Why don't you report Helen and tell her to get a real job.
TO ABE : As mentioned before, people who cannot distinguish between that which is real and that which isn't have mental health issues. M is not the person in need of a treatment.....Helen is.
TO ALL THE POSTERS ON "DUMB AS A STUMP": CAN I NOMINATE SOMEONE?
AND LAST BUT NOT LEAST: To those who have nicknamed Kevin "Hitler": There are only two sides to every story- the right side and the wrong side. Most times everyone is on the wrong side but they don't know it. Countries have prayed to the same God while being at war with each other. How does one know what the right side is? God's side is the right side.
We should not follow men. We should follow our hearts and when our hearts condemn us, we need to look to God. There is much more to life than petty quarrels among bloggers. There is more to life than finding the OCCK. There is more to life than your life. In 100 years you will not be here. Ever thought about where you are going to be?
You can find answers, if you are interested, in the Gospel of John, Chapter 3. -Note-Now that you know Kevin was a BIG FAKE-Don't you feel a little stupid?
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 14, 2011 21:08:34 GMT -5
Then when your Big Thread got deleted from AMW-you were all going to start a knew one and here was the plan-From: ScottStap1 10:54 am To: johnsbrother unread 33 of 35
3851.33 in reply to 3851.28
Stevo said in the thread "post respectfully" that your thread was somehow a personal attack on Helen.
Evidently Helen is visiting this web site but not responding and she clicked on the "report" (or one of her followers complained).
I would suggest to you that you start a new thread entitled "Slander in the OCCK CASE" or something like that. Then, do NOT mention Helen's name but just say "there's a woman going around the internet..." etc. We'll all know what you are talking about.
It stinks that you have to rebuild the thread but it will be GOOD too, because we can all review your arguments against these lies all over again. I myself wouldn't mind reviewing it.
It's disheartening, I know, but I bet if you do not use "her" name and speak only about the lies, and don't engage in ugly banter with those who come in to support her but merely state "your facts are quite lacking" etc. that you might have a thread that lasts a long time.
Respectfully...
Scott (Jeff)
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 15, 2011 0:04:06 GMT -5
AMW-SHUT THEM DOWN-Forwarded Message: AMW Forum AMW ForumFriday, May 13, 2005 1:37 PMFrom: "steve.brock" <steve.brock@prospero.com>To: "'Bingotank@Aol.com'" <Bingotank@Aol.com>Hi Helen. I heard about your concerns regarding a thread in the AMW forum. I wanted to let you know that it has been removed. In the future, please contact me directly if the problem persists. -- Steve
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 16, 2011 15:22:10 GMT -5
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 16, 2011 22:57:12 GMT -5
Mar 13th, 2005 - 1:08 AM Re: Please find a different hobby!
Below is a post from the AMW website.
I am “John’s” sister, Mary, identified in several posts on this AMW site in the last few weeks. I received a telephone call from Kdogg after AMW posted my name and employer. He indicated that my family and my brother John, in particular, were the subject of forums on the AMW website, that Helen’s allegations had gone “national” and that I should check it out. He thought that posting personal information was out of line especially because of the content of the postings. He later contacted me about other sites which revealed personal information about my brother and family. Before Kdogg called me, I had absolutely NO KNOWLEDGE, nor did my family, of what Helen was doing or saying on the internet. (thank you Kdogg). I have read some of the information posted and I am horrified by the lies and delusions of Helen and others who have believed her.
First of all, Helen has had NO recent and/or continual contact with our family! She called me ONCE, 15 years ago. She called my father and stepmother ONCE, several years ago, lying about John and almost gave him a stroke. She has NEVER spoken to my mother or any of my siblings except John. She told me in her one call to me that she had an "intimate" relationship with John but now denies it. She is not interested in the OCCK….She wants personal information … information that is none of her business to use for her own manipulative “thing”.
I told Kdogg that if he or anyone was really interested in the truth about the OCCK that they should go to the police and ask them. Ask them anything! Since he lives in the area….he did exactly that. (thank you again kdogg!) Kdogg was told by THE POLICE exactly what we are saying. JOHN IS NOT THE OCCK OR BTK. Neither John nor anyone in my family has ever been involved in these murders. JOHN WAS CLEARED! He didn’t do it! There is no family of serial killers! There is no family secret! There is no network of family murderers from Michigan to Georgia to Florida to California! The agencies appointed to investigate these crimes have heard all Helen has had to say and have, I believe 4 times, come to the conclusion that JOHN IS NOT THE OCCK and that HELEN HAS A PROBLEM. Why don’t people believe the police? How many times does a suspect have to be cleared before people believe he is innocent? 100 times? 1000 times? 100,000 times? Helen would still insist she knows better. She is guilty of libel, slander and character assassination.
People who have visited Helens site wonder how John knew so much about the murders. Our family lived in Birmingham in the vicinity of the OCCK murders. We all knew about the murders because everyone’s lives were devastated by them. It was in the paper and on tv everyday. It was talked about everywhere. Everyone was looking for the killer. People were putting together clues, analyzing maps and looking at friends, neighbors, ex boyfriends, anyone, to solve the mystery. If you lived in Birmingham, Michigan, YOU would know a lot about it as well! As much as John . I knew a lot about the murders because I lived there, read the papers, watched the news ….. and guess what, I’m not the killer either! I am more than willing to give any and all information regarding any investigation of suspects TO THE POLICE, as I have done in the past.
If any of the readers/members of this forum are really interested in the truth, talk to the police yourself. MEET WITH HELEN FACE TO FACE. SHE IS SAYING HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE THINGS! Get the facts. ALL THE FACTS! It's the Police Department/Legal System's job to investigate, prosecute and convict criminals, NOT HELEN’S! I believe the police have information they don't share with the general public, much less Helen. It is a very foolish and dangerous thing to listen to only one side of a story., especially from someone who is trying to keep everyone from seeing the WHOLE TRUTH.
I have been to Helen’s site. She posts ONLY what she wants to post. Ask Kdogg. Ask Mystic. Ask Nancy.
Helen would not reveal John’s identity and that of the family for years and would not allow those "under her influence" to reveal this information. Was it because she didn’t want anyone to contact the family and challenge her ? Was it to build her own little OCCK cult? It certainly wasn’t because of a “high legal connection”. The truth is the truth, right? Can’t be sued for telling the truth, right? Wouldn’t she go down in history as the crime solver of the century? So what was she afraid of? Nothing but the truth is my guess.*(-Note-Nothing in this post is true-However I don't have time to correct it tonight-)
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 18, 2011 18:13:51 GMT -5
Ok Mary here we go-My answers to things you said in the above post you made at AMW--What was that -that Nancy your sister-in -law always posted at My American Indian Site-She would say -"Helen Needs A Reality Check"-Yes,well someone needed a Reality Check-So let me give you one---You said,In your post "First of all, Helen has had NO recent and/or continual contact with our family! She called me ONCE, 15 years ago. She called my father and stepmother ONCE, several years ago, lying about John and almost gave him a stroke. She has NEVER spoken to my mother or any of my siblings except John. She told me in her one call to me that she had an "intimate" relationship with John but now denies it. She is not interested in the OCCK….She wants personal information … information that is none of her business to use for her own manipulative “thing”. *Bad Choice of words-At the time you had posted this-If I had been making calls to your family 15 yrs before--then I would not of met John yet-But then maybe math wasn't one of your strong points--also I never called YOU back then-I did however call your mother several times-and she indicated to me-Please don't tell Mary I talked to you-or told you anything-as she will be very mad-I think the reason you made reference to my calling you-is you wanted-to get in something-that -you made up-That I was Intimate with John-G-Mary had I been-I sure wouldn't be discussing that with his sister! I still have all my phone bills from those years-and you are not on them-but your Mom is- Now for your Daddy and your step mommy-I happen to of called your father 3 times and your Step Mom twice-before you made this post back in 2005-and the conversations were very pleasant-I do realize that after the last call I made to your father-He had to go to the hospital-I think your SM said 5 days in a row-for his high Blood pressure-Well-The only way I think that can be explains-is that after he had time to think about are discussions-He realized he had told me things he shouldn't have-Like where the Shoot gun was and which of his children owned it-The automobiles you all where driving back in the day-and the Jobs you all held-and The water Tower Death-and denying he had ever heard about the King Boy-telling me he was gone from the area when that must of happen and I had to correct him-as I had the divorce papers in front of me and other court papers-which clearly placed him in the area-So I Imagine this all did shake him up-Almost like getting a polygraph I imagine-the calls I had with your Step -Mom-she told me about his reaction-and in the first call-all went very well with her-and in the second call-she let me know that Mary said she was going to sue me if I called there again-Well that sure didn't scare me-as that mite be the only way-we could ever clear this all up-anyway-I didn't call her any more-I had no reason to-I had all the Info I needed-plus-who would call anyone back-who didn't want to talk to you-but she did give me her email address-which I never used-However, speaking about emails-Guess your little brother never told you about the emails I sent him-the first one -he sent back an empty email to see if my address was active-I had asked him -"If we could talk about the Family secret?-I guess he didn't want to-then the next year-I sent him and email with my phone number in-and he wrote back-Who are you?-did you get my email address from my site?-lol---There was another one also-but I would have to dig that up-and it isn't important enough for me to do that-and as for your other two sibs-I never contacted them-because I didn't want to give them any heads -up-as I always felt if anything would become of this-that would be the two people who would crack the easiest----
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 18, 2011 18:33:50 GMT -5
Some of the garbage you put in that post has been answered so many times-that I will just let it go-and the stuff about Kdogg's credibility,well we all know Kevin lied about absolutely every thing he told you-or anyone else about me-and that has been covered with Documents -and it sure has been proven-you lay down with Dogs-you get up with Fleas---So you went on to say*-If any of the readers/members of this forum are really interested in the truth, talk to the police yourself. MEET WITH HELEN FACE TO FACE. SHE IS SAYING HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE THINGS! Get the facts. ALL THE FACTS! It's the Police Department/Legal System's job to investigate, prosecute and convict criminals, NOT HELEN’S! I believe the police have information they don't share with the general public, much less Helen. It is a very foolish and dangerous thing to listen to only one side of a story., especially from someone who is trying to keep everyone from seeing the WHOLE TRUTH." *** This is such a crock of S--t Mary that I need to say something-Like this statement from you-MEET WITH HELEN FACE TO FACE. SHE IS SAYING HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE THINGS! Get the facts. ALL THE FACTS! "* Well Mary let me give you the facts-I did say Horrible things-However I didn't do it maliciously-I was repeating the Info John gave me-and guess what? It was all true and is backed up by your interview with Don Studt-Funny you would forget that-But hey-I have the FOIA papers to prove it-your FOIA papers!-So I guess John didn't lie to me about so much stuff-did he?- I was surprised to see -That you had said-that everyone in your house at one time or another had hit your mother!-We never did that at are house-But then no one ever accused my parents of having a home that was a breathing ground for a serial killer-
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 18, 2011 18:44:13 GMT -5
Mary said-"Helen would not reveal John’s identity and that of the family for years and would not allow those "under her influence" to reveal this information. Was it because she didn’t want anyone to contact the family and challenge her ? Was it to build her own little OCCK cult? It certainly wasn’t because of a “high legal connection”. The truth is the truth, right? Can’t be sued for telling the truth, right? Wouldn’t she go down in history as the crime solver of the century? So what was she afraid of? Nothing but the truth is my guess.*"The reason weather you choose to believe this or not-was,because at that time this wasn't about anyone but John-and your so called buddies if they were capable of telling the true-(But Their Not) Could have told you this-and then also I had made a promise to John that I would not use his last name-So Mary anyway you look at it you got this all wrong-and very cleaver of you-to say just go to the police and they will tell you-lol-you knew that no cop would ever give out this info to the public-nor anything you said to them-and you never thought that I would see your interview with Don -Ever---Well I can not fault you over that-as a lot of people got shock therapy-once those papers got out-
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Post by Helen Dagner on Sept 18, 2011 18:51:50 GMT -5
So where does this leave you and I Mary?--I think you need to go out side and smell the roses---As far as my posting any more of your terrible lies-from your Internet days-I most likely won't -as they would require and answer from me-and I really do not have any time I want to share with you...* Well I could make time-If you wanted to talk about "-THE FAMILY SECRET"
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