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Post by Helen Dagner on May 29, 2011 5:50:08 GMT -5
Did The Occk??-While enduring childhood punishment and unfair discipline from his parents create an execute -the perfect plan-for his warped sense of justice? Was it fueled by the cruel mental abuse suffered at the hands of his extended family? His dedication to the mission Of showing them-he could do something and do it right-did it lead to the murders of four children?Did the meticulous attention to detail-allow him to not leave any forensic evidence at four abduction and drop off sites and keep his Identity-in the shadows for 34+ years? Has he committed the perfect Crimes? Now think about his motive-doesn't sound like a sexual predator to me...does it to you?
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Post by Helen Dagner on May 30, 2011 0:36:56 GMT -5
Well of course, it's all important. I think some of the most interesting stuff are those divorce papers. They do absolutely nothing to show guilt. But they help back up what you say ( or John said) about the violent and unhappy home. Somebody could say those dates are just a coincidence, but they can sure raise an eyebrow. It also helps, if they were looking into John's case, show some motive. That's the thing nobody understood. What kind of a monster could do this. They assumed it was a pedophile because he choose kids only. But no pedophile is going to have young girls hostage for a couple weeks and not touch them sexually. There had to be another motive. Maybe if you can use some thing like that to support what John told you. Make sure they see those dates......like during the time Kristine was held, John's mother got a restraining order against his Dad...just days before Kristine was killed. Also very, very important are the pants with the embroidery on Xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx The one were the paper said blue jeans. I have a feeling that's what made them listen to you. Yes, I think if it were me, I might hold a little tidbit back. Not that you're not trying to lay everything on the table. Maybe give Gray the benefit if the doubt.. call him one more time .but maybe hold a little tidbit, that you could provide later if you feel you trust him. Are you planning on saying anything to Gray about Anthony Mitchell? He may not want to even talk about a case which was deemed an accident, but again....the location is uncanny. But again..good luck proving anything. Good luck!! Sgt.Xxxxxx
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Post by Helen Dagner on May 31, 2011 2:43:06 GMT -5
He wanted to cause the upper class deep and permanent pain, he decided that since money could be replaced the only way to do it was to strike at their children, besides this was something he could do, were as taking their money was beyond his ability...each killing gave him a sense of power and significance and intellectual superiority...yet some how he felt he was saving the children... At the time of the murders, John was writing a book on the economic collapse, and causing a major depression, ruining the upper class...bringing them down to his level...he was still working on the book when I last saw him.
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Post by Helen Dagner on May 31, 2011 22:53:36 GMT -5
It was a four drawing collection of gruesomely illustration-{ as they look back}-it amounted to a voyeuristic autobiography, a way to relive his crimes without actually confessing. I asked how they knew it was Johns bedroom they were in-and they said they had been to the home several times with the intent of buying it ..but they could never have access to the room..as it was always locked..and they asked or told the mother -we need to see that room or we won't be back with and offer -she said...I can not open it as I am afraid of my son John ...as he has told me NEVER GO IN THAT ROOM....!!! Wanting to get the house sold she eventually got permission to go in the room....The reason i remember the drawings so well is all that was in the room was and old matress on the floor and the drawings tape to the wall...she said I will not describe them to the public as they give me nightmares just talking about them....
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Post by Helen Dagner on Jun 2, 2011 0:30:37 GMT -5
You know, I'm starting to think that perhaps John may have had some pedophile tendencies based on the one post/email I have that mentioned he had cut out newspaper circular ad's with little boys wearing underwear, do you think there is a chance this is true? Helen, I think any of them could have pedophile tendencies or interest, especially if they were molested as kids. While not all men who were molested go on to molest, it can completely mess up their "boundary" system and set up all kinds of inappropriate future nuts. I guess part of the lesson here is that ANYONE can be a pedophile, even if they have otherwise seemingly normal sex habits. And I doubt that most guys would admit this to anybody, except another pedophile. Xxxx
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Post by Helen Dagner on Jun 3, 2011 14:04:18 GMT -5
Helen, When you talk to Johns family,how do they re-act? Sue-* Note: Well Sue His family have been more than nice to me. However,before we are done talking,they always state, Helen, you have the wrong guy and I then say,I don't think so.....
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Post by Helen Dagner on Jun 6, 2011 20:50:21 GMT -5
Helen, It amazes me that the police could over look the fact that John had the books in his possession at one time, though, with them stolen it is difficult to prove that he had them unless there was a picture of him with them etc Tim
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Post by Helen Dagner on Jun 7, 2011 18:32:42 GMT -5
So many of you have asked me if John had gone to college, well, John and I did not talk about it but, John's father and I did, he said John had 6 years of college but, no degree. He was studying to be an engineer and planned of going into architecture.
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Post by battista on Jun 7, 2011 19:47:02 GMT -5
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Post by battista on Jun 7, 2011 20:50:11 GMT -5
It looks like you might not want other people posting on here...sorry, if so. In that case, I can close this account, and just keep reading your updates. Keep up the good work!
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Post by Helen Dagner on Jun 7, 2011 22:06:27 GMT -5
Hey Welcome--I didn't get a chance to answer your post-I have a lot going on--
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Post by Helen Dagner on Jun 7, 2011 22:13:30 GMT -5
Hi Helen, Have you seen this? Probably nothing. www.yellowpages.com/user/yp/john7150/reviews To answer your question-no I had not seen that add--But I do know where John is and where he works ect. But I'm sure the readers enjoy seeing new things...I was surprise to see you post-as no one seems to be able to register --feel free to post anything you would like to...
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Post by Helen Dagner on Jun 10, 2011 3:16:30 GMT -5
.But to answer some -John did not play me-John did not work under cover with me at anytime-John's only words to me about Busch....were that he had a friend who had commited suicide 5 years ...but on the same date that my police officer husband killed himself....I never even conected it too Busch...untill a Detective I was working with caught it by the date--as far as Busch being involved in the Oakland County Child Murders...He wasn't!!!.....Now I really must state....John and my story ...stands as I have always written it.....I would not change a word of it.....I guess what is happening here on this forum-Is the same old -same old.... most of the posters have done no real investigation...oh yes you looked up a few old newspaper articals...copy a few lines-added to it your theory-Then to say well you never read about John in any Newspapers...is laughable---of course you haven't....He is their number one suspect...and they -Law Enforcement!!!....and they are protecting that Info....In the event...They ever get this to court....One other thing-The autor of the poste that say the ALLEN letter came from a now dead guy who was a teen at the thime...is just plain full of S-Dr. Danto wrote that letter him self!.....
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Post by Helen Dagner on Jun 11, 2011 14:39:31 GMT -5
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Post by Helen Dagner on Jun 12, 2011 19:44:34 GMT -5
I'm a year older than John. "The Catcher in the Rye" was required reading for my generation. And not required by any school curriculum. We cut our rebellious, anti-establishment teeth on Catcher in the Rye. That book was a rite-of-passage for us, an anthem to our baby-boomer teenage angst. It's right up there with the Rolling Stones' "Satisfaction," as in, "I can't get no."--lol--Most of us read "Catcher" and ended up doing too much sex and drugs and rock n roll. Evidently, one read it, and became a serial killer. Not sure how much Catcher in the Rye had anything to do, with any of it. But, don't let me interrupt the interesting discussion. lol Mel
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